FactCheck: How generous is Danny Alexander’s pensions deal?
“Yes, we are asking public service workers to contribute more. Yes, we are asking them to work longer, along with the rest of society, but we are offering the chance of a significantly better pension at the end of it for many low and middle income earners.”
Danny Alexander, speech to the House of Commons, 2 November 2011
Cathy Newman checks it out
Millions of public sector workers are preparing to go on strike next week – the biggest industrial action since the Winter of Discontent. Some 20 unions could walk out on November 30 in protest at government plans to make them pay more into their pensions, and work for longer.
Ministers know the action will be disruptive. So they’re doing everything they can to try and persuade the unions to call it off.
Danny Alexander, the Chief Secretary to the Treasury, has one central argument: that the new deal will mean better pensions for many low and middle income earners. But FactCheck has found a flaw in his claims.
The analysis
Danny Alexander claims his new pensions deal is significantly more generous than the current deal. He does concede that like the rest of us, the public sector will have to work longer and in most cases pay more – but he insists the deal should be enough to silence any further talk of strike action.
“This generous offer should be more than sufficient to allow agreement to be reached with the unions,” he said, warning the unions to call off next week’s strike, as the deal “is conditional upon agreement being reached”.
In his speech, Mr Alexander pointed MPs to a document setting out the deal in detail. It gives examples of the changes to five different public sector workers’ pensions: a teacher, a nurse, a civil servant, a local government chief exec and a local government administrator.
The document ‘Public Sector Pensions: good pensions that last’ claims for example, that a 40 year old male civil servant with 18 years of service would only have to work 18 months more – to the age of 61 years and 6 months – to get his existing pension deal.
And if he retired at 67, the civil servant would be £3,700 better off.
That doesn’t sound too bad. Except last week, a new pensions calculator popped up on the homepage of the Civil Service website. And the problem was – its findings were wildly out of sync with Mr Alexander’s.
The calculator showed that the government’s civil servant would have to work an extra four years under the new deal to get even close his previous pension.
In fact according to the calculator at the age of 64, he’d get £141 less per year.
And if he was to work until 67 – after seven years more work – his “generous” increase would be a total of £2,567 per year – 30 per cent less than Mr Alexander promised.
The calculator has mysteriously disappeared from the Civil Service website. The Cabinet Office told the Public and Commercial Services (PCS) union that it has been taken down for “presentational reasons” and will be back up shortly.
The Treasury told FactCheck: “As many objective observers have noted, we have made a generous offer which is much more than most in the private sector can expect. These differences arise because of different assumptions. The Cabinet Office calculator assumed the member retires on a higher salary than under the HMT example. The HMT example assumed that the member took a three year career break during his working life (thereby reducing the amount paid in).
“Irrespective, in either example, the government clearly meets its commitment that low and middle income earners will, at retirement, get a pension as good if not better than they get now.”
Cathy Newman’s verdict
Last time I looked “significant” meant “meaningful”. So are “many” low and middle income earners in line for a significantly better pensions deal?
On the numbers helpfully crunched by the government’s online calculator, I’d argue not. The average civil servant featured would have to work a whole four years more to get the same pension payout as they’re currently due.
And even if they wait seven years to hang up their boots, retiring at 67, (as the government would like) they’d be just £2,567 a year better off – 30 per cent less than Danny Alexander promised.
No wonder the unions aren’t impressed. I’d say it’s a racing certainty next week’s strikes are on.
The analysis by Emma Thelwell



There are 57 comments on this post
I enjoy working longer & harder to subsidise others to have an easier life than I.
The reform should have come over the previous administration which quite rightly pumped more money in the form of higher wages in the public sector, but some of the public sector perks should have been negotiated downwards in return for the increased pay deals.
As is always the way, the Tories pick up the pieces & take all the flack.
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Even if the public sector pensions are reduced it won’t stop you having to work longer and harder as most of the workers involved will end up claiming benefits when they retire. The average payout in local government is £3800 a year. Is that really gold plated as the Mail would have you believe.
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The reform did come under the previous government. A new pension deal was struck in 2007.
That deal was recognised as affordable and appropriate.
This current government has been drip-feeding a steady stream of lies about public sector pensions. First, they said they were unaffordable. When that was proven to be inaccurate, they claimed they were unsustainable. When that was also proven to be inaccurate (read Hutton’s report) they changed tack again and are now saying that “it’s not fair”.
Is that what we’ve come to? “He’s got a better pension than I have, so take it away from him.
Chidlish, schoolyard arguments.
The torys are, yet again, indulging in the politics of envy. And, whilst we fight amongst ourselves over a few pennies, the real villains at the top of the pile look on, laughing, as they siphon off the big money via tax avoidance and evasion.
With respect, you’ve fallen for their lies, hook line and sinker.
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It’s not about reducing the pension, it’s about reducing the taxpayer contribution to nearer (but still higher,unfortunately, than) a level that is available to the many.
Taxpayers, well private sector ones aren’t the cash cows the unions & Labour would have you believe, we’ve had enough.
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I am pensioner now having retired as a teacher 3 years ago after around 30 years in comprehensive schools in Glasgow(east end)- not an easy ‘gig’-but I fully recognise that we were very generously paid latterly and I could see trouble loomimg. After all it was really only a very few fans who ever believed that Gordon Brown had abolished boom and bust so clearly a bust was coming.The teaching profession up here was basically bribed with all sorts of arrangements unlikely to remain( see the MCrone settlement)Some of its arrangements were laughably offering a lot of pay for an ‘all quiet on the teaching front’ they could boast about for years to come. Reality bites in the end. We have had it so good so here goes and then we can all turn round and blame ‘the toffs’-Tories. It’s where Scotland is comfiest after all.
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I think if you look at the whole picture, I believe there is a convincing argument to suggest that this has very little to do with affordability of even fairness for the tax payer.
Given that the affordability of public sector pensions was confirmed by the National Audit Office.Given also that this government is determined by their ideological beliefs to reduce the size of government and to promote the greater use of private companies to deliver public services. This has more to do with reducing the future costs to private businesses than getting a fair deal for tax payers.
So I predict a future where private companies provide an inferrier service to maximise their profits, which will go towards paying dividends to wealthy shareholders. These private companies will then as they already do, become adapt at lobbying ministers for more money from the tax payer to provide these services.
The mantra from these neo-liberal governments is that the private sector is more cost efficient and reliable, you only have to look where private companies have entered into the areana which was once provided by public services to know that this is just not true.
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I take it Uncle Bob is a banker or is it *anker
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Could you clarify what the public sector perks are?. I have been a health visitor for the past 15 years and i certainly haven’t received any.
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No we are not asking the tories to take the blame for thousands of unemployed, the highest number of young people & women unemployed in a generation, and we are not blaming them for allowing the Bankers to get huge bonuses and wages while the ordinary people sweat blood to pay off a deficit caused by the same bankers.
We are not blaming them for cutting Billions in housing and then offering a few million to ‘kick-start’ the housing market.
Lastly we are not blaming the tories for having 21 millionaires in their cabinet and who are making policies to keep their rich friends happy!
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Tories lying again… what a surprise. Expect strikes, occupations and protests to become part of daily life. The 99% is waking up.
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Cathy/Emma,
I hope the strikes go ahead and I hope they are solid. It is the only way to get deadfaces Osborne/Alexander to deal decently.
Nobody wants to go on strike but there are times when it is an absolute necessity. Defending your old age is one of them.
The CamCleggies will steal everything to hand over to their pals – health, education, housing and now even old age. They’ll loot anything.
Enough is enough. It’s time to stand up to the thieves and liars. After all, they’ve had a free, subsidised ride for the last generation, a welfare state for the rich.
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I work in the public sector as an administrator. The default age at which LGPS pension can be claimed is 65. It can be claimed earlier but will obviously be less than the full rate. I’ve no idea where the idea that ALL public sector workers can retire on full pension from the age of 55 came from. For people at my level it has always been 65 and certainly not “gold plated”
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It’s not fair that someone on minimum wage works all the way to state retirement age (not earlier like most public sector workers) & contributes more to someone’s pension pot than they can afford to their own.
I hope the strikes are called off & these greedy public sector workers grow a sense of reality & stop leaching off those of us who can’t afford it. These unions looking after their comparabily well off & greedy members need smashing.
It’s unfair I work more hours a week & will work more years of my life whilst unable to afford to protect my own future but have to pay for someone else who’s better off.
Increased pay deal after pay deal under last Gov should have eradicated sone of these benefits not available to the majority.
Disgracefully greedy & selfish.
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Chris you should not believe all the headlines. Most public sector workers are like me, clerical, admin and the like. We are not the overpaid bigwigs at the top who do not do the graft and hours we put in (no overtime pay, ever). We have not had a pay rise since 2010 and will not get one before 2013. I reach the grand age of 65 in January but have no plans to retire because, like most of the working population, I cannot afford to while there are still mortgage payments to be made. Also despite what you read we do contribute towards our pensions AND the bigwig pay-offs/bonuses>
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It’s still a pension pot that receives a much higher contribution from the employer (ultimately the taxpayer) than pensions available elsewhere.
Given that the pay deals which were a cornerstone of the last Gov didn’t reform these kind of benefits not available to the majority, it’s unfair on low paid private sector workers to subsidise the lifestyles to an extent that far outweighs what’s available to them, if they can afford to pay into one at all.
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So, rather than engage in meaningful action to raise the value of your own pension pot or force a review of private sector pensions, you’d rather slash public sector pensions instead? Yes, let’s all race to the bottom to see who can become the poorest faster.
I think what a lot of people are failing to understand is this: public sector pensions are not a gift that the government generously bestows upon us; they are part of the contract between employer and employee. That contract essentially says, “In exchange for you working x hours per month, you will be paid a certain percentage of salary, and the remaining percentage will be placed aside to fund your pension.” So you see, the money for pensions comes out of the remuneration that I and thousands of others signed up for when we took the jobs.
Don’t like paying public sector workers a salary? Fine. Let’s see how you get on when nobody empties your bins, there are no hospital staff, fires rage with nobody to put them out, there is no-one to pay child benefit or disability benefit, local amenities stand idle, the streets are not cleaned. Then wonder if maybe, just maybe, the public sector can be pretty bloody…
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Ridiculous over-reaction & don’t even grasp the debating point
It’s not about slashing pay or pensions, it’s about a deal which is fair for tax-payers.
Employer, (taxpayer) contribution percentage is higher than ‘the many’ receive.
And as for your rant about salary, the streets aren’t cleaned, the hospitals have too many staff pushing bits of paper around, amenities do stand idle as many councils, particularly Labour one’s have cut services rather than non-jobs
But that’s all irrelevant to a pension deal that is fair for taxpayers, particularly low & middle paid private sector ones.
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John, just because the tax payer is the employer doesn’t mean that the employees should suffer an injustice.
After all, it is the taxpayer as customer who contributes to the profits of many private companies which is then paid out in large salaries and in many cases very large pensions.
You indignation would be more understandable if you were equally concerned about the fact that many valuable public sector workers (nurses, firemen etc) are paid far below what their skills contribute, while the fat cats fail to contribute their share of taxes.
It would also be have more force if you were indignant that the pain of the crisis brought about by bankers and speculators were not being brought to bear on many public sector workers who had nothing to do with creating the situation. It is they who are being put out of work or having their salaries frozen while bankers continue to rake in the cash.
We don’t pay public sector workers as a charity or as some unearned benefit – they supply valuable services and often well below what ‘the market’ would expect if those jobs were in the private sector.
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Chris you state that work for the minimum wage, well firstly thank the trade unions for their lobbying of government to introduce it. Secondly you state that our pensions are a burden on you the tax payer. What we are trying to protect are the living standards that we have invested in, which will hopefully mean that we will not need additional benefits when we reach retirement. Unfortunately for you, as you state that you are receiving the minimum wage, if things continue along in the same way, you will need to receive additional benefits to make sure that you have a sufficient standard of living in your old age, which of course us tax payers will have to subsidise. Your situation is not as a result of us tax payers, but due to a failure of the private sector to provide adequate pensions for its employees. My advice would be to join a trade union and fight for a better deal.
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John, you say it’s about fairness for the taxpayer. OK, let’s engage in a little experiment.
Do you, or have you ever, claimed working family tax credit or child benefit? Let’s assume you have.
Do you have a car? Again, we’ll assume you do.
I’ve paid tax which has, in turn, been paid to you in benefits and has allowed you to afford to run a car. Accordingly, I’ve decided that you can’t have your car anymore because it isn’t fair on me. You see, I can’t afford a car. Why should I pay taxes to be given to people like you in the form of benefits so that you can swan around in comfort?
You see how it works? Given enough time, we can all identify people who have something we don’t, and we can all justify why it isn’t fair. That, Sir, is what we call a race to the bottom.
Alternatively, we can all grow up and act like adults.
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Thanks Chris for confirming what it is like working in the private sector and informing others what they can expect as services are transferred.
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Our wages were lower to make up for a better pension, we work hard and long, our pensions were part of our salary package and are now being taken away, this is a tax on the poor, we are not rich, we were already struggling and will not be able to pay the extra to Treasury NOT to our pension! Tax the rich, £120Bn is evaded and avoided, get that moeny into the economy first!! we are not greedy, the Millionaires in Cabinet are greedy adn misguided.
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Cathy, I’m certainly detecting a bit of left-wing bias in your posts of late. Rather than using Danny’s figures or the online calculator why not work out the real numbers for yourself? The figures aren’t that complex.
If the online calculator does include a 3 year break then that’d quite easily explain the discrepancies between the two figures, right?
And I can’t see anywhere where you’ve actually discussed low or middle earners? Only high up administrators and averages across the public sector…
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Left-wing, I don’t think so….perhaps the centre ground is shifting. Some people are being squished you know, …best hope it isn’t too many media types.
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The reforms have never been about affordability and they still do not address the fundamental flaws in pensions that we have. The problem is not pensions in private v public sector it is pensions at the top and the bottom of the income scale across all sectors. Lets start by removing higher rate tax relief on pension contributions and then we can afford to think about what our priorities really need to be.
The second flaw we need to address is how the pensions funds are invested. Tying them to the stock market means they are vunerable to the huge swings, and get mugged for huge fees when no value is added. Lets use these funds for long term investment – social housing for example – where there are more predictable returns.
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Having considered the carefully researched statement of Danny Alexander, having seen how often government statistics appear to be partial at best and taking into account the fact that Mr A is a lib-dem who stood on a no top-up fees manifesto, I have come to my conclusion.
I’m with the strikers.
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How far should this ridiculous race to the bottom go? Many workers in the private sector have no pension provision at all, so maybe the same proportion of we ‘greedy’ public sector workers should suffer as well.
The civil service scheme that I belong to made changes in 2007 to reduce the future burden on the taxpayer (and by the way, public sector workers are taxpayers too – all our taxes go to a big pot that is divided out into areas of expenditure). Those changes have been independently verified by the NAO, Public Accounts Committee and even the Hutton Report (despite Francis Maude shamefully lying that it said otherwise) as having the desired effect. There are agreements in place to ‘cap and share’ future costs if they rise.
So why is the government asking me to pay more now (on top of a 2-year pay freeze), work longer, and get a lower pension at the end? My pay has been frozen for 2 years and I have the same rising costs as everyone else. This is deficit reduction, pure and simple, and shameful when so much tax relief on pensions goes to the 1% at the top.
Maude/Alexander: you won’t dare arrange indepedent valuations of the schemes, because you know you’re lying.
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If the state cannot afford to pay its employees a decent pension how come we can still cough up millions towards the private offices of people like Thatcher and Blair?
All in this together gets more and more hollow.
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This deal is particularly bad for LGPS workers who already pay significantly more pension contributions than the civil service (in the order of 4%). I agree that all public sector workers should pay the same contributions but the LGPS scheme is largely self funded and sustainable having had a large increase in contributions in 2007. It should be treated separately to the rest IMO.
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I just think its sad that so many private sector workers are so quick to jump on the laughable bandwagon of political media spin. Personally, I think its disheartening to find so many gullible people out there happy to accept the word of a bunch of politicians terrified of actually focusing on the real problems facing the country. It wasn’t the teachers, the police, the firemen and women, the cleaners, the bus drivers etc that brought this country to its economic knees. The spineless politicians are happy to divert our attention from their abject cowardice to address the financial fat cats that are still running the country the way they want it. I would beg any who feel that the public sector is somehow deserving of this pillage of our pensions first calmly contemplate what it is they give back to our people, our communities. I don’t pretend to know the ins and outs of private sector pension plans, but I don’t leap to assume that they don’t deserve more…I just fail to understand those that believe that the public sector deserves less, simply because the private sector don’t get more. That just smacks of selfish greed and jealousy, rather than a matter of fairness.
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I don’t understand why these people who say that public sector jobs are easier and better paid than private sector jobs don’t come and get jobs in the public sector.
Is it because, in reality, the equivalent jobs are actually usually worse paid and tend to involve lots of unpaid overtime?
I enjoy my public sector job, because I like the satisfaction that comes from serving the public and that offsets the fact that I could increase my wages by about 20% if I got a similar private sector job. I don’t mind working extra hours for the same reason. And I’m no martyr. I don’t want praise, but I would like to keep the pension I was promised. And I would like it if you would please stop slagging me off all over the internet.
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Several people have made the point that it is illogical to say that public sector workers’ pensions should be reduced because private sector pensions are not as good. I agree.
I don’t hear bankers say that their pay and bonus increases should be frozen because public sector pay has been frozen.
It’s typical of the double speak that surrounds so much of our public affairs.
Steve Bell has summed it up in the Guardian today with a cartoon pointing out that Cameron is condemning strikers for harm they can do on one day of non working while he is currently sacking thousands of public sector workers, putting them out of work for possibly years. But that of course is doing the country good!
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If you consider that only around 9% of Civil Servants actually receive the going rate for the job i.e. the top of their pay scale. You have to wonder why the “high paid Civil Servants” myth is circulated? Pay has been effectively frozen since 2008, with no improvement in sight. This means that salaries have actually been cut, relative to inflation, by up to 20%. Why should they then have to pay more into a pension scheme when their salary has already been depressed to provide for their pension? This used to be stated on the Civil Service pension scheme website, but has since been removed.
Civil Servants did not cause the public purse to empty or indeed apply for the hundreds of billions in loans, but we are being asked to pay for it!!!!
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A better “FactCheck” would be how much the average private sector employee would receive as a pension if he contributed the same amount that a public sector employee does.
And all this talk about “affordability” is bunk. It is affordable for the government to give me £10m. It isn’t fair though. This whole debate is actually about fairness. It is unreasonable to expect private sector workers to work for longer and contribute to the pension of their public sector counterparts who often retire a decade earlier. The reality is that we are all going to have to work longer, pay more and get less. That the private sector will have to do this so the public sector doesn’t have to would be a gross injustice.
Re. the average local government pension being £3,800. Can we do a Factcheck on that please? What is the average private sector pension? Most people don’t have one. And how is this £3,800 calculated? Does it include part time workers and those who have served for only a few years?
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Alex, I agree that private sector workers shouldn’t foot the bill for public sector workers. But that isn’t what is happening no matter how much the govt tries to spin it.
Private sector workers and public sector workers pay tax. A portion of this tax goes towards public sector pay. A portion of that public sector pay is deferred, in other words public sector workers set aside a portion of their pay to go towards their pension.
Private sector workers do not have good pensions because they have been raped by the banks. Now they are attempting to do the same with public sector workers.
You should support the public sector workers and direct your protests at your employer and ask them to provide you with a better pension.
The Public Sector unions are the last significant body of people who can hopefully make some change as successive govts have destroyed the unions (and our voices).
Support your Public Sector.
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When I left the private sector to work in the public sector I had a contract of employment which included my pension. I took a pay cut to work in the public sector. I am a supervisory admin grade & the bigger wage earner in my household. As we have heard time and time again our pensions ARE affordable. If there is to be a change then change it for new starts, after a cut off date like private sector companies do. That way my contract of employment hasnt been breached/changed by my employer.
I did not cause this economic crisis, I do not receive a large salary, a large bonus or share options. I pick up a newspaper and everyday I see detailed accounts of money that is being wasted ie £15,000 to reframe 5 paintings in one dept. The Bankers and the over paid executives are to blame for this crisis so they must pay. Also all the companies that are either avoiding or being let off with huge tax bills should also be made to pay up. Not the ordinary tax payers in any shape or form of which I am since 1987. I hope that the whole country comes to a standstill on 30th November and sends a strong message to Government.
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We are told today that the PS strike could cost the country £500m.
Doesn’t that just show how valuable these workers are and how much they deserve a decent pension?
After all, our MPs take weeks off at a time and that doesn’t seem to bring the country to its knees and yet they have very generous pay offs when the electorate kick them out and larger pensions than most PS workers.
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Public workers get no perks apart from a pension.
No Bupa, company car, profit sharing, – even Tesco workers get discount on food etc!
The MP pension scheme is the most generous of all.
Any chance of them taking a cut?
Thought so!
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I misread the headline and expected to read about Danny Alexander’s *own* pension prospects. I bet they are brighter than mine (recently retired from the lower reaches of the public sector). I won’t repeat the points made above, but I’m with strikers on this issue.
MPs have looked after themselves rather well: I guess they are the only group of public sector employees whose pay and pensions aren’t being targeted as part of the national deficit reduction programme. Am I right? Anyone in a position to fact-check that assertion?
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For everyone who works this is not fair.
Danny BEAKER Alexander will come out at the end of his career £440942 richer every year.
This equates to £26.404 per week!!!
I mean is this a sick joke?
How do these fiends actually deserve this kind of money?
Why is it they don’t come out with the same pension scheme the plebs do?
Jeez,the STENCH of corruption and greed in this world along with inequality never ends.
We the mass public are to blame because we sit back and TAKE THIS blatantly occurring in front of us and say “what can we do?”
Time and again come election time the cross goes in the box again and so it continues.
But,the country is divided rich-poor,i care- i don’t care,people not wanting to rock the boat,take a little short term pain for the long term gain,so,history,as per usual repeats.
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I think the point of the argument is that this is a new tax imposed by Cameron and his cronies on Public Sector Workers Pensions. The Public Sector worker will not benefit from any additional contributions made but this money will be used by Whitehall to pay off the debts created by their mates in the banks. What will happen when these Pension Contribution increases occur? Simply put the majority of Public Services Workers are on low pay and some barely on the minimum wage. How can they afford these additional contributions from their wages with the current cost of living? The answer is that they will cancel their pension’s and some 20, 30 or 40 years time when they retire the State – being the Public will have to subsidise their income (by benefits) so it could be your children or grandchildren who end up footing the bill for this government’s mistakes.
In addition if Cameron and his cronies decide to change the law on strike action e.g. 50% support for strike action from union’s then they themselves will have to adapt the same terms – if that were the case any political party would find it impossible to form a government by their own political party.
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It is not an easy decison to take strike action. As someone who is a proud public servant and believes in public services, that the general public, the 99% rely on. But as a woman, I will stand on Wednesday for all those women who have stood before me and those who come after.Women in this country have fought for access to pensions, equal pay, and pension rights for same sex partners. I now have to fight for that very pension. On N30 I will be one of the women, we have been waiting for!
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Its the teachers,police and town hall/DWP exec pension that need to be sorted ie the “gold plated freebees”and not the sub 20k pa public servant. Would you agree to public sector savers in a building society receiving 40% interest on their assets paid by the taxpayer and others offered the regular 1.5%? Not I. As for the private sector pension,these were tax raided by Mr Brown in 1997 and have been a useless investment since. So please dont blame the co. directors
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I will give up my ps pension,if i can have the same pension as MPs.Maude and Alexander get back to the table now because after the next election you will be unemployed. We wont forget who has lied to us!
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The country, we are told, cannot afford to pay its public sector workers the pension they were promised when they signed up. We are all living too long and well, the country is broke.
Yet today we read that the MOD has agreed to spend £2bn preparing to update our nuclear deterrent – and that is before it has been agreed to update that colossal waste of money.
The only argument for the UK having its own nuclear weapon would seem to be that it gives us clout in the world and makes our politicians feel even more important.
It will never be used and it is certainly irrelevant in preventing terrorism.
And aren’t we among the countries arguing that other nations shouldn’t have nuclear weapons becaue they make the world a more dangerous place?
Somewhere along the line, mankind’s priorities have got out of kilter. Bombs before decent living standards for the elderly; miles of tunnels under Europe to find out about the big hang before clean water for Africa; huge short-term bonuses for bosses, frozen wages for their staff.
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George Osborne tells us that the success of his plan A is that the government can continue to borrow money at low interest rates.
Yet he is about to announce £30bn of infrastructure spending, most of which will be funded by pension schemes and the Chinese.
Isn’t this PFI by another name? Won’t the pension schemes and Chinese investors want a higher rate of return than the interest rates of which George is so proud?
Or is he using up those ‘cheaper’ loans to pay the debt that is escalating because of Plan A?
Sometimes my head hurts trying to find some logic in what our politicians do and say.
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One of the many problems with public sector pensions is that there are so many of them and the terms & conditions are all different. I would like to see a comparative analysis of a selection of public sector schemes to show how much is contributed and for how long; compared to the amount of pension paid (as a % of salary) and the age of retirement. Perhaps you could compare the pension schemes of teachers, nurses and local government staff with those of senior military officers, the judiciary and MP’s? Then perhaps we would be able to see if the current proposals are fair to all public sector employees.
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Some really interesting comments, but what a terrible article. I think if you are calling an article “FactCheck” then your analysis should more or less be based on the facts. Whether it be £2,567 per year or £3,700 – that is an increase – and personally I would consider it “meaningful” as well. You explain the difference yourself, due to a 3 year career break etc. Why do you then go on to ignore it? Over the lifetime of a pension it adds up to a lot of money. But let’s stick to the facts.
“Yes, we are asking them to work longer, along with the rest of society…”
“The average civil servant featured would have to work a whole four years more….”
Like the man said.
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Lets stick to the facts:
Yes we are being told to work longer
Yes we are told to pay more
Yes we are being told to accept less
No there is no justified reason for doing this
Yes we don’t like it and therefore are going on strike
Yes the government refuses to address the exorbitant bonuses of high paid Executives
Yes the government is against a Bank Transaction Tax
Yes there has been an increase in inequality in this country over the past 30 years and the government’s proposals to raid our pensions will increase this inequality.
Yes I don’t understand why you would what to defend the actions of government that you yourself proclaim sees you in a job on the minimum wage. I don’t understand how you could believe that this government represents your interests when all the evidence suggests that you are not one of the top earners in this country.
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How clever the politicians are being – divide and conquer. Private sector versus public sector, the working person needs to wake up. Why should people not work towards a pension… and incidently I pay 6.5% of my salary towards a LGPS pension. What sort of pension would private sector workers get if they contributed that amount towards a company scheme that employers had to contribute to also. Do you know.. in the long run the tax payer will be funding a lot of people in a few years time who do not have the fall back of a pension in old age. Good luck to the Public sector workers and also good luck to private sector workers, lets stop the bickering and fighting which is encouraged by politicians
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My Union tells me that there are several things HMG will not negotiate on and this is why they have taken the view the negotiations are pretty meaningless:
[1] The change from RPI to CPI;
[2] The overall amount of money the government wants in increased employee contributions over the next period i.e. before the other changes are implemented. This means that the protection for the low paid will be paid for by the middle and higher earners and many of the former are by no means well off: I’m probably one and have a smaller income than the regional average;
[3] The closure of final salary schemes for those still in them (incidentally several schemes were closed by the last Labour administration but this hardly ever gets into the media);
[4] The retirement age; in fact they’ve recently hardened the line on this and effectively asked for a blank cheque by insisting it be linked to the state pension age – which can be moved.
You can take your own view on how “meaningful” negotiations can have been if this information is accurate. You should also factor in that several schemes have “cap and share” mechanisms in them allowing risks and costs to be shared by employees…
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There is a tendency for those looking at the public sector to only look at those on a higher pay, as an admin officer I am on a lower pay than someone in an equivalent position in the private sector. One of the things drawing me to the position was the decent pension, this however is now going to cost me about £60 a month more how is that fair?
Also those in the private sector BEWARE, this means that your bosses will be able to impliment the same to your pensions. Don’t assume you are above this it is already happening look at Marmite.
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Has anyone ever heard of the Scott report, produced for Mrs Thatcher in 1981? It records that civil servants have been contributing 8% towards their pensions for the past thirty years, by having that amount notionally top sliced off their salaries to compensate for reducing the retirement age for men from 65 to 60. Adding a further 3.2% on top of that means that civil servants will actually be paying 11.2% of their salaries towards their pensions, but will receive as much as 25% less when they finally start drawing them. Facts.
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